John: Good evening, I'm John Yang.

President trump and Ukrainian leader Volodymyr Zelenskyy said today that they are closing in on a peace proposal aimed at ending the war with Russia.

The two leaders met today at Mar-a-Lago in Florida.

Pres.

Trump: Have two willing parties, we have two willing countries.

They want to see it the people of Ukraine want it to end and the people of Russia want it to end and the two leaders want it to end.

John: Today's talks involved just the United States and Ukraine.

While there's been -- been no official response from Moscow, in the days leading up to the meeting, Russia intensified attacks on Kyiv.

Zelenskyy says that's evidence that president Vladimir Putin isn't interested in ending the war.

Michael Mcfaul teaches at Stanford university and was U.S.

Ambassador to Russia in the Obama administration.

President trump to Putin for about an hour beforehand.

He said he will call him after the meeting with Zelenskyy.

What do you think his reactions is or are going to be and to what is in this proposal?

Michael: He has already stated.

He has already been on TV.

Yesterday.

And his foreign policy advisor, who I used to to negotiate with when I was the ambassador, has already said so.

They don't want a cease fire.

They said that clearly.

They want all of donbass.

And he said either we will get it peacefully or militarily.

In the proposal, at least the one president zelenskyy publicized a few days ago, the 20 point plan, it does not give Russia all of the donbas retreating Ukrainian forces out of that part of donbass that they control.

My guess is, I hope, that Putin will take this seriously and negotiate toward the end of this horrific barbaric war.

My fear is that he is going to reject it.

John: You talked about Russia.

He had a briefing for reporters after the telephone call earlier.

He set the pro -- that president trump and president Putin agreed that Kyiv must make a courageous, responsible political decision regarding the donbass, and given the, situation on the front lines Kyiv must not delay making that decision.

It sounds like the president is going to pressure Ukraine on this point.

Is there any leverage that he has exerted on Russia?

Michael: No.

That is exactly the most important point.

I applaud president trump for trying to end this war.

I think he had to talk to Putin and zelenskyy as he is doing today.

That is part of negotiations.

What he is strategically miscalculating is that his strategy has always been to put pressure on zelenskyy and never pressure on Vladimir Putin, or the Russian armed forces or the Russian people supporting the war.

Time and time again, he keeps asking zelenskyy for more concessions, and there are more concessions, by the way, in this new proposal than there were six months ago.

Extraordinary concessions from my point of view, that the Ukrainians and president zelenskyy is proposing.

But Putin just keeps pocketing those concessions and asking for more.

And I predict he will continue to do so, unless president trump changes course in 2026, and puts pressure on Russia.

To do that, that is more weapons for Ukraine, and more sanctions for Russia.

John: What are some of the concessions in this proposal that surprise you on the Ukrainian part?

Michael: First, we are not even talking about the occupied territories anymore.

If you look, at least that what was put in the public domain and I want to be clear, I have not seen the secret documents, but what is in the public domain, the Ukrainians are not even disputing those territories that are currently occupied by Russia.

That is a huge concession.

Second, they have now put on the table a proposal for how to govern donbas which would include, if Russia agrees to do the same, a retreat from the contact line right now.

That is another extraordinary concession.

The twist to it all, importantly, is that zelenskyy said he could only agree to do that if there would be a referendum of the Ukrainian people to endorse it.

But it is a major concession that was not part of the talks six months ago, let alone a year ago.

Ohn: He is proposing that area become either demilitarized zone or free economic zone.

How would that work?

Is that something that Russia would support?

Michael: I don't think so.

I think so far, we have seen no evidence that Putin is willing to do that.

He keeps saying donbas needs to be ours through peaceful.

Or military means.

I have negotiated with the Russians in my career.

And I know that they always adopt maximalist positions until the endgame of negotiation.

One could hope for that.

Publicly, so far, he has rejected that idea.

He wants to conquer it by military means.

John: In our last 30 seconds, where do things go from here?

Michael: Again, I hope Putin will take seriously this new proposal.

I think it is a fair proposal.

.

A lot of concessions from.

The Ukrainians.

A fear that the war will drag own and this time next year, tragically, I think they will still be fighting in eastern Ukraine John: Former ambassador Michael Mcfaul, thank you very much.